there seems to be a lot of positive posts on this section of the forum about srtaight men in female clothes. What is the feeling generally about men in skirts / dresses. I would love to be able to have the choice of trousers or skirts, in the gender equality age we supposedly live why not. the girls have had the choice for decades. I do look foreward to feedback, why is a male in a skirt looked on as gay.
phil wrote:
there seems to be a lot of positive posts on this section of the forum about srtaight men in female clothes. What is the feeling generally about men in skirts / dresses. I would love to be able to have the choice of trousers or skirts, in the gender equality age we supposedly live why not. the girls have had the choice for decades. I do look foreward to feedback, why is a male in a skirt looked on as gay.
Phil...... you better hope none of the Forum's Scots read this. You'll be in deep do-do. If they don't violate the Forum's rules at your expense, they'll be hitting the 'Report This' button for cultural ignorance.
Best to post an apology while you have a chance, mate. : )
I'm eagerly awaiting my second boss to get his shorts out so I can, but no dresses, no skirts.
Wasnt there a point in time where it was frowned upon if a woman wore trousers?
See, humans are judgemental. We are good at it and we probably developed that sense to save our asses back in the day when it was life or death, eat or starve. Judging a person and a situation was what could save out skins, it still does all day every day. (Have I got time to cross the road before that car gets here? etc) anyway society sets up a standard of behaviour that is seen as normal or standard and any wild deviations from this path is seen as eccentric, strange etc. Not by all people obviously. In tribal cultures it is perfectly the norm for the guys to be wearing grass skirts. In scotland, the national traditional dress for men is the Kilt. If it fits within societies normal expectations it doesn't cause much of a stir but if you deviate from them it draws attention and when people do not understand something it can scare them. people feel the need to catagorise things to feel safe I guess. To try and make what they see, fit into a box or a stereotype of some kind, to make sense of it, to make it less scary or intimidating or strange to them.
Not everyone assumes man + skirt = gay. There are many married couples of male/female sex where the male wears female lingerie or clothes, for many reasons like it turns him or them on, it makes him feel free, and in some cases its an issue of transgender (Of which I do not know much about, having never experienced it myself or done much research on it)
I have said it once and I will say it again.. wearing womens clothes doesnt make you gay, enjoying anal doesnt make you gay, enjoying XYZ does not make you gay.....
What makes you gay is specifically being sexually attracted to, and wanting a physical/emotional relationship with someone of the same sex as you.
Simple really.
Unfortunately when people are scared, they try to pigeon hole other people. "He wants to wear a skirt, oh he must be gay then" why must he be gay? All gay men wear skirts do they? It is kinda madness really but thats the way humans work. We try to make sense of things usuing what knowledge we hold at the time and it is usually the ones who are just either uninformed, ignorant, nervous or scared that jump to conclusions faster than the ones who are more open minded and will ask questions and not try to pigeon hole based on a particular trait or desire you have as a person. Just remember it is hard as humans to accept something with which we feel uncomfortable with. It just is, as open minded as many of us are, there will always always be something that we will draw the line at, or make us feel nervous. We are all so different.
Fluffbags wrote:
Wasnt there a point in time where it was frowned upon if a woman wore trousers?
See, humans are judgemental. We are good at it and we probably developed that sense to save our asses back in the day when it was life or death, eat or starve. Judging a person and a situation was what could save out skins, it still does all day every day. (Have I got time to cross the road before that car gets here? etc) anyway society sets up a standard of behaviour that is seen as normal or standard and any wild deviations from this path is seen as eccentric, strange etc. Not by all people obviously. In tribal cultures it is perfectly the norm for the guys to be wearing grass skirts. In scotland, the national traditional dress for men is the Kilt. If it fits within societies normal expectations it doesn't cause much of a stir but if you deviate from them it draws attention and when people do not understand something it can scare them. people feel the need to catagorise things to feel safe I guess. To try and make what they see, fit into a box or a stereotype of some kind, to make sense of it, to make it less scary or intimidating or strange to them.
Not everyone assumes man + skirt = gay. There are many married couples of male/female sex where the male wears female lingerie or clothes, for many reasons like it turns him or them on, it makes him feel free, and in some cases its an issue of transgender (Of which I do not know much about, having never experienced it myself or done much research on it)
I have said it once and I will say it again.. wearing womens clothes doesnt make you gay, enjoying anal doesnt make you gay, enjoying XYZ does not make you gay.....
What makes you gay is specifically being sexually attracted to, and wanting a physical/emotional relationship with someone of the same sex as you.
Simple really.
Unfortunately when people are scared, they try to pigeon hole other people. "He wants to wear a skirt, oh he must be gay then" why must he be gay? All gay men wear skirts do they? It is kinda madness really but thats the way humans work. We try to make sense of things usuing what knowledge we hold at the time and it is usually the ones who are just either uninformed, ignorant, nervous or scared that jump to conclusions faster than the ones who are more open minded and will ask questions and not try to pigeon hole based on a particular trait or desire you have as a person. Just remember it is hard as humans to accept something with which we feel uncomfortable with. It just is, as open minded as many of us are, there will always always be something that we will draw the line at, or make us feel nervous. We are all so different.
Yup Fluffbags..... what you're talking about is 'cultural norms' and the consequences of deviating from those norms. In our culture, it's abnormal for men to wear a skirt. A man found wearing a skirt is therefore going to provoke other people to make a judgement about him. The judgement is likely to be that he is trying to identify himself as being 'female'...... and why would he want to be seen as 'female' ?....... probably because he's gay.
Ork wrote:
Its a kilt no a skirt :P
To be honest though, I think the "gender equality age" is a myth, kind of like how its okay to be gay etc, it is in some places but not all. A man in a kilt is looked on as gay, due to ignornce and stupidity of many people. In Scotland a man in a skirt is a man in a skirt, a man in a kilt is a man in a kilt, best not to confuse the two if you ever come here lol... though wearing a kilt is a good way to avoid the whole "gay" issue.
Overa all if you intend to go out in a skirt, I'd make sure you are aware of the potential danger you may be putting your self in, obviously any where you live/go that will vary... not wanting to scare you out of the idea, but its best to be realistic about it.
A kilt is a length of fabric wrapped around the midriff. That makes it a skirt. The kilt, however is a skirt with a cultural and national identity. So for a man to wear a kilt is a (commendable) celebration of his Scottishness. For a man to wear a non-kilt-type-of-skirt in public....... yup...... he might be airing his privates, but he's also putting his neck in a noose.
BUT if gay marriage gets onto the Statute Book, paving the way for homosexuality to be as acceptable in society as heterosexuality is...... then maybe it's only a matter of time before it's common for men to be seen in public wearing skirts.
Come to think of it, I wouldn't mind having the freedom to wear some of the wonderful garments women have access to. It is curious that women can wear pinstriped suits and bluejeans..... but woe betide any man that slips on a dress.
Fluffbags wrote:
Wasnt there a point in time where it was frowned upon if a woman wore trousers?
Joan of Arc was tried and executed for wearing trousers, a bit extreme I admit.
This is a western thing, in many areas of the world men wear what could be regarded as a dress in the west particularly Arab African and Asian countries. The sub continent adopted trousers for men when it was part of the British Empire.
Ork wrote:
It is a severe shock to many people to find that the "little kilt's originator may well have been an Englishman, one Rawlinson, who was employed as the manager of an iron smelting works in Lochaber who adapted it, to allow more freedom of movement for his workers. (Probably so they could work faster being the concerned English they were). Be that as it may, it is this form of garment which is now firmly taken as being the kilt.
I thought the short kilt was introduced as the traditional garment kept catching alight in the foundry
i love love love a guy in a skirt or dress . tights with it ? even better .. you can make a little hole in the crotch and play through it ...
rubysoho wrote:
i love love love a guy in a skirt or dress . tights with it ? even better .. you can make a little hole in the crotch and play through it ...
Wot ? ...... crocket...... or cricket ?
I seem to have caused some debate on this subject, but please I am well aware that a KILT is not a skirt. I own a proper Scottish kilt and wear it on special occacions with no adverse reactions. Fluffbags hit the nail on the head, society seems to like to pigeon hole people into catagories and anything different is to be attacked. Maybe I should have titled the post - if fashion changed would men wear skirts.
Fluffbags wrote:
Wasnt there a point in time where it was frowned upon if a woman wore trousers?
To some extent it still is.
My finacée is a Lawyer and has regaled me with stories of a number of Judges (both men and women) refusing to hear female Lawyers if they notice them wearing trousers instead of skirts. As little as twenty years ago it was rampant and Judges had been known to adjourn until the Lawyer changed, or even reschedule a hearing or trial if she refused. Fortunately it doesn't happen quite so often now, if at all. (That said, my fiancée no longer practices in courts so wouldn't know anyway).
Avrielle_Aniko wrote:
Trousse (sp?) were the alternative
It's Trews.
Spelling-wise you appear to be thinking of Tresseau, which if I recall is something collected by a bride for marriage and often inc. cloth.
Mr Socks wrote:
Fluffbags wrote:
Wasnt there a point in time where it was frowned upon if a woman wore trousers?
To some extent it still is.
My finacée is a Lawyer and has regaled me with stories of a number of Judges (both men and women) refusing to hear female Lawyers if they notice them wearing trousers instead of skirts. As little as twenty years ago it was rampant and Judges had been known to adjourn until the Lawyer changed, or even reschedule a hearing or trial if she refused. Fortunately it doesn't happen quite so often now, if at all. (That said, my fiancée no longer practices in courts so wouldn't know anyway).
Avrielle_Aniko wrote:
Trousse (sp?) were the alternative
It's Trews.
Spelling-wise you appear to be thinking of Tresseau, which if I recall is something collected by a bride for marriage and often inc. cloth.
How nice to have yet another learn-ed person in the Forum!
Lifebuoy wrote:
Mr Socks wrote:
Avrielle_Aniko wrote:
Trousse (sp?) were the alternative
It's Trews.
Spelling-wise you appear to be thinking of Tresseau, which if I recall is something collected by a bride for marriage and often inc. cloth.
How nice to have yet another learn-ed person in the Forum!
Thinking about it, I believe the Scots Gaelic spelling is Truis. It may be the same in Irish Gaelic. I can speak neither nor have the inclination to research right now, so haven't a clue really.
Ooops! Just noticed my spelling mistake. I meant Trousseau. Trousse is a diminutive of...meaning something along the lines of 'bundle'. Do Scots have a 'bundle'?
Err...Thanks Lifebuoy!
Further to a comment you made elsewhere re Mr Bumcheeks and how one can easily misconstrue its significance. My inital reading of your statment was almost dripping with irony. Am I over-analysing? There's a lot to be said for the duality of meaning.
I'm medical: condescension comes naturally.
Sorry (sincerely). Given the query mark, I thought you wanted the correct spelling.
Avrielle_Aniko wrote:
Mr Socks wrote:
I'm medical: condescension comes naturally.
Sorry (sincerely). Given the query mark, I thought you wanted the correct spelling.
That is ok, I appreciate the apology. The spelling is useful to know as my spelling is usually ok, but some words I muddle up and some words I've genuinely never seen written down! (Trews being one of them..)
The parts that seemed a little patronising was:
Trousse is a diminutive of...meaning something along the lines of 'bundle'. Do Scots have a 'bundle'?
and
Spelling-wise you appear to be thinking of Tresseau
Just seemed like you were mocking me... Just so you know what I'm slightly miffed at. But I'll say no more on this matter. Apology accepted. ^.^
(P.S) I rather enjoy reading some of your posts though. You have some pearls of wisdom in there. :-)
I really am very sorry Avrielle and didn't mean to be patronising. Once I get started on a subject I often have some difficulty in knowing where to stop and can sometimes come-off as a bit of an arse. In all honesty, it just seemed an interesting addendum to expand my earlier comment, that sprung to mind when I noticed my typo. The notion of two divergent articles potentially being mistaken (with hilarious consequences, naturally) due to a simple perception of spelling. Okay, massive geek though I am, that sort of thing is pretty fascinating.
Rest assured, no mockery was intended.
PS Thank you! I try to be informative.
Hi all
Personally I love wearing skirts, long ones, short ones etc, have even been known to wear a kilt , but as a scot I feel I can get away with it as from a notorious highland clan.
But as a lowland scot, the genetics are still there that if we see a man dressed in the plaid(the 12 yards wrapped around his body), he would be shot or hung as a cattle thief.
There are many urban myths about kilts and clan tartans, most originating from victorian times, as after the last great rebellion in 1745, the wearing of the plaid was outlawed and General Wade enjoyed this first attempt at ethnic cleansing.
All that said, I wear a kilt outside and it feels so good, but my skirts are for purely indoor bedroon fun.
I'm up for wearing skirts and have been told by women that I look good in them (was a few years ago, though!). In my rural domicile I'm not sure everybody else is ready to see me in a skirt, but should the opportunity arise, I'll be there!
The kilt is a skirt, most kilts today are moving away from traditional tartan to plain colours and patterns such as paisley and are even made of denim. I wear a womens denim skirt and its a fraction of the cost of a kilt and more comfortable and less restrictive. Feel absolutely fantastic whislt wearing it.
Ok, so to answer your adjusted question OP "If fashion changed, would men wear skirts" I asked this to my guy and he said yes. (I actually asked him "If fashion changed and there were no cultural norms in place against a guy wearing a skirt, would you wear one")
So thats one vote for yes.